I’ve apparently read my limit of Wired articles this month.

What’s it say?

If there’s one thing that can unite the world in these AI-troubled times, it’s everyone’s love of SUVs. For decades, the SUV has been the savior of the car world. Accounting for nearly half of all new sales worldwide, this is by some margin the largest segment in the global auto industry.

Sedans? Forget it. Ford doesn’t even sell a traditional sedan in the US now. China still likes a sedan. About a third of all Chinese autos are in this form, compared with less than half that for the US. But Chinese carmakers know full well how much we love our chunky SUVs, so they are focusing their efforts to lure the Western world away from familiar marques.

Indeed, Xiaomi has just played its hand in this particular game, revealing the remaining details earlier this month in Beijing—including the all-important pricing—of its coming SkyNomad SUVs. Bentley and Range Rover may well have revealed their flagship electric SUVs, but both will be mightily worried about just how many scalps Xiaomi Auto’s SkyNomad SUVs will take from them. If they’re not, they should be. Sedan to SUV Image may contain Transportation Vehicle Car Car Interior Car Seat Chair and Furniture

The new Xiaomi Auto SkyNomad N70 is a five-seat, extended-range EV that has better technology than a Range Rover at half the price of a Velar. Courtesy of Xiaomi

Trucks and SUVs represent more than 80 percent of new vehicle sales in America these days. Marc McGrath, US CEO of the automotive manufacturer Schaeffler Group, tells WIRED that one of the main reasons the company is developing its own solid-state batteries is to properly electrify the power-hungry trucks and SUVs Americans so dearly love. No one wants another F-150 Lightning U-turn.

The shocking success of the Jaecoo 7 is a prime example of SUV supremacy. This Chinese-made ride has enjoyed a staggeringly meteoric rise in the UK, going from an unknown newcomer in 2025 to now being one of the country’s best-selling new cars. Nicknamed the “Temu Range Rover,” it comes in both gas and hybrid flavors, and the company liberally uses the word “luxury” in its marketing, yet the vehicle costs just £29,210 (a little over $39,000).

These 7s are becoming ubiquitous on UK roads. My local Nissan dealer has swiftly dumped the Japanese brand and is now an official Jaecoo dealer, offering not just the 7, but the Jaecoo 5 and 8. I can’t think of another auto brand that’s enjoyed such a rapid rise.

Other Chinese brands are playing the same tactic in Europe, such as XPeng and BYD, but the big one incoming is Xiaomi Auto, set to launch in Europe in 2027, despite only making its first EV in 2024. Astonishingly, its SU7 Ultra claimed the title of “World’s Fastest Sedan” the very same year.

Far from a Temu pretender, the SkyNomad is not only tech-laden, it’s also seemingly high-end, with seating that purports to be “more like an Italian sofa.” The SkyNomad N70 is a five-seater that, especially in its “Stealth Black Edition” guise, looks almost exactly like a Range Rover from the outside, and far more successfully than the Jaecoo. Image may contain Cushion Home Decor Floor and Window Courtesy of Xiaomi

The N90 Max Studio has a pop-up roof that lifts 100 mm to open a sleeping loft. Image may contain Computer Electronics Laptop Pc Accessories Glasses Adult Person Transportation and Vehicle Courtesy of Xiaomi

The SkyNomad floor rail system makes for a super-configurable interior.

The larger N90 is a seven-seater that also comes in a “Max Studio” camper version, complete with a pop-up roof. The second row can transform into a bed with one touch of a button—no disassembly, no mattress needed—just 30 seconds from upright seats to a flat, large bed.

The theme of reconfigurable interiors continues. A flat floor, courtesy of the Kunlun platform, comes with sliding rails built in from the front seats to the boot, meaning all (yes, all) the seat sections can move about. The front seats spin a full 180 degrees to face the second row; floor-mounted tables slot between the rows to make for “living-room-style" layouts; the center console can move forward or back at the press of a button; and rear legroom can max out at over 5 feet. In the N90 Max Studio, the pop-up roof lifts 100 mm to open a sleeping loft with 1.8 meters of headroom, along with heated flooring (!), a built-in projector, and a 30-inch projector screen.

An amazing optional extra for the SkyNomad is Xiaomi’s version of in-brand car-to-car communications. Essentially, it’s a walkie-talkie that runs on cellular network coverage rather than short-range radio, so it’s marketed as having “unlimited range” and looks very similar to tech Xiaomi already ships in its phones.

Just stop for a minute and compare what you’ve just read with the sorts of interior innovations Western brands deliver on flagship models these days. Power doors, multi-point massage seats, relaxation programs with scent sprays, and a central console that moves maybe 10 cm are the typical cutting-edge fare. The SkyNomad makes US and European efforts look, frankly, lazy—right when they desperately need to stop their decline and show they can compete. Image may contain Transportation Vehicle Car Car Interior and Car Seat Courtesy of Xiaomi

Despite the price, Xiaomi is offering an aggressively specced SUV. Image may contain Transportation Vehicle Car Aircraft Car Interior Cushion and Home Decor Courtesy of Xiaomi

Seat rows can move forward and back, allowing floor-mounted tables. Image may contain Chair Furniture Transportation Vehicle Cushion Home Decor Car and Car Interior Courtesy of Xiaomi

The front seats can swivel around 180 degrees to make meeting spaces. Image may contain Furniture Courtesy of Xiaomi

A low-power fridge continues to cool when the car is powered down.

There’s more. “Full scenario” voice control; customizable head-up display; lidar units, high-definition cameras, and Nvidia’s Thor-U chip for level 2-plus autonomous control. A low-voltage power system apparently keeps “sentry mode” drain to under 5 kilometers of range overnight, so the onboard fridge running on 0.72 kWh a day can offer up to 24-hour continuous cooling.

The extended-range plug-in hybrid powertrain combines a 1.5-liter turbocharged internal combustion generator with battery packs and dual electric motors. This ICE engine never drives the wheels, but the SUV can charge from 20 to 80 percent in as little as 18 minutes for a 300-plus-mile electric-only range, or 1,000-mile combined range. Yes, these stats use China’s far more forgiving CLTC cycle, but this converts to about 700 miles using stricter US EPA standards.

Now to the clincher: the price. The maxed-out N90 Max Studio with its camper roof clocks in at RMB 299,900, about $44,700. The entry-level N70 Pro five-seat, rear-wheel-drive model with its movable “Italian sofa” seats, lidar, 14-speaker sound system including subwoofer and headrest speakers, and prodigious range is just RMB 209,900, or just over $31,000—about the same as a 2026 Hyundai Tucson.

Earlier this month, I asked a Western luxury auto CEO what he thought about Xiaomi Auto. He laughed. “They make vacuums, don’t they?” he scoffed. I think he’ll rue the day he said that. It reminds me of when, in a 2011 Bloomberg interview, Musk laughed when asked if he saw BYD as a competitor. Musk isn’t laughing now. Make no mistake, Xiaomi is coming to clean up.

Im curious why the headline says $31k but the article says $39k

$39k is referring to the Jaecoo 7, isn’t it?

you’re a real one for that copy paste mate

Damn, never though I’d say this, but I think China is gonna save capitalism from itself.

My guess is that these Chinese manufacturers will kill the old automakers that are in rapid decline after decades of low quality products at high prices.

I don’t know if the Chinese brands have good quality but they’re priced lower than the expensive low quality trash that’s already on the market from all the other automakers.

Free market? Not like that!

Don’t worry, I’m sure there’s another bailout and another cash for clunkers with a side of tariffs getting cooked up by some lobbyist to get passed by some paid off politicians. They are already trying to/already have pass(ed) a complete ban on Chinese autos. Knock knock, they are already on both borders.

sell cheap to kill competition around the world. leverage new global monopoly for fun and profits later.

This. I’m all for competition and innovation, but this is subsidized by the Chinese government to exploit a lack of manufacturing in other countries.

If you’ve heard about how food or clothing donations harm local farmers and weavers, same principle. We should be encouraging domestic production around the world, not allowing one country to undercut everyone else.

China has been playing the long game for 30+ years. When you have actual history and strategy(and unlimited exploitable labor( you’d be amazed what you can accomplish.

China is doing exactly what other countries and corporations do to establish and compete in markets.

Let me repeat it: China is doing exactly what other countries and corporations do to establish and compete in markets.

And because it doesn’t ever seem to sink in: China is doing exactly what other countries and corporations do to establish and compete in markets.

Newsflash: Sinophobia is not an economic strategy.

Edit: "“All for competition and innovation” The United States barred China from buying the latest NVIDIA chips to keep it out of AI. Typical American racist scapegoating.

Yeah and it’s bad when other countries do it too

This thread is so fucking ignorant and choking on MAGA propaganda. Look this up idiots: the US of A has subsidized Detroit far more than China in the auto industry and BYD was heavily invested by US investors like Warren Buffet.

Warren Buffet bought 10% of BYD because US options were all losers. From 2008 to 2022 he made $8.75B.

This sub has USG-sponsored China fear mongering posted multiple times a day.

The USA has yet to kill the UAW which they must do to be competitive. It’s not an end-all be-all solution (wages are only like 30% of the cost of a car), but a good start. It also needs an entirely local battery supply chain, buying from China isn’t an option. And they need to pay for every EV that is manufactured, no matter where it’s sold to.

But the US won’t take it seriously so they’ll never compete for real. Maybe they’ll kill UAW but only to increase shareholder value, not to compete for real.

They use this same tactic over and over and I find it surprising that more people don’t immediately recognize what they’re doing.

I guess it’s just more enticing than “maximise profits for the few even if it means the planet dying”. All western auto makers can get squeezed for all I care. I’d buy their products, but they spent a decade sabotaging it and making sure it keeps spewing poison.

I have no pity for toxic companies that fought tooth and nail against EV development. The tactic works because it’s taking advantage of a broken system.

Nah. It’s just another rug pull in preparation. Undercut prices until the competition breaks, then fuck things up with your monopoly. We’re in the undercutting prices phase, but the Chinese will want to have their fair share of interest on the subsidies they use to do that right now. It’s the same old fucking capitalism again and nothing is saved from it.

Yeah. Companies running on state subsidies competing with others who are not is not capitalism “working”, it’s just another rug pull leaving us all fucked.

I guess in this fantasy scenario of yours, the United States is the one that doesn’t subsidize the auto industry? lol

I love how criticizing the Chinese car industry leads people to thing I love the American one.

The US hasn’t produced a decent car since the 60s. I don’t even factor them into the calculation.

I didn’t say you loved it, I asked if you didn’t think it was subsidized.

Not to the same degree or in the same way. In the US the name of the game is to have companies run themselves into the ground to line the pockets of CEOs and investors, and then the state bailing them out every time because of jobs and national pride.

I’m sure there are other systems in place as well, but frankly I don’t care. Teslas are pretty much the only American cars you’ll see in Europe, and they’ve been subsidized by European countries to promote the electronic transition.

In short, I don’t think about American cars at all.

Everyone said this would happen when Japanese cars started being sold in the US. It never happened.

Detroit isn’t even trying to compete.

China is better at capitalism than the US is.

The United States greatly prefers that corporations be in charge of the government to governments being in charge of corporations.

Not much difference in the outcome for the general population.

That‘s a reach, if I ever saw one. China lifted more than 800 million people out of poverty, and in fact eradicated poverty at all. Last I heard, their standard of living just closely missed being in the high income countries category. Their trajectory is in complete contrast to the declining Western empire.

China is better at capitalism, because it‘s their only play to stay sovereign and overcome this predatory system completely. They have to prove to the capitalist world, that their system and long term development is superior and it‘s only beneficial for the world to follow their transition towards socialism to enable prosperity for all humankind, not just the global north. Not gonna happen under capitalism, especially not under the US or the EU.

Thank you for coming to my TED Talk.

Unless you are Tibetan or Uyghur.

I try not to let US state department propaganda narratives dictate my perspective on their geopolitical adversaries.

Sure and Tiananmen Square never happened.

Recently

You are the one denying issues with Tibet and the Uyghurs.

Nah man, not „denying issues“. I‘m just not willing to jump through hoops, because you keep throwing propaganda talking points at me.

Uyghurs and Tibet, Tibet, Uyghurs, More Uyghurs

Breakthrough News, a media outlet hated by Trump, has some actual reporting on China with their regular China Report. On the linked video their guest is Ben Norton of Geopolitical Economy Report, another excellent resource.

E: How quaint.

This is just not true for an enormous number of people. The wealth disparity is striking. The ones who are making it are making it, but it is nowhere near everyone.

Disparity is rising in China with the development of the private sector, but it is fundamentally true that the CPC primarily focuses on developing the living conditions for the working classes:

Essentially, capitalists are winning the most, but the CPC ensures that more than anything the lives of the working classes are focused on. Additionally, as the private sector grows, it gets increasingly controlled and subsumed into the public sector. The privledge capitalists have rest on a dying basis because their purpose is to facilitate development towards higher levels of socialism, through developing the productive forces more rapidly. This is the tradeoff China made, and its working.

20% youth unemployment and this tankie is posting this lmao

Well none of this (including the price) would be happening without massive government subsidies so I’m not sure here is the place to take a victory lap for capitalism due to artificially low prices designed to win market share abroad, but okay.

China is better at capitalism than anyone else is. It’s not even close.

Time to unleash the storm on these piece of shit American car companies.

They’ll be banned faster than you can memorize the spelling of Xiaomi. At least in the US, where we make sure the old inefficient companies stay afloat despite their incompetence.

Chinese cars are heavily subsidized by the state. The reason they’re so cheap is because China bets it can squeeze the competition out of the market before charging basically whatever they want.

I’ve seen Starbucks do the same thing to independent coffee shops.

Edit: This is a post about real car companies like Nissan, Volvo, Mercedes, Renault, whatever. I don’t care about America. Nobody has for decades.

Oh yeah, because US car companies are NOT subsidized at all /s

Sure, but try launching a new auto startup here. It’s a lot harder than in China.

Wrong. US manufacturers have effectively been shut out of China. But not before they made investments that China basically stole.

Who would want a US made car?

Even Americans don’t want them.

I worked in the government for a bit, national park service if it matters, we were only allowed to use US made vehicles.

Constant recalls, constant breakdowns, overall unreliable. These were all vehicles that were less than 5 years okd

I have a 2007 toyota today that refuses to die and has barely needed any work. I’ll probably have it at least another 3 to 5 years at this rate.

American cars are shit

American capitalism has rendered companies incapable of producing anything that’s not crap at a scale because they need to maximise profit at all costs, while quality doesn’t mean shit. Every company is Boeing.

It’s very possible your Toyota was made in the US.

Except for the design and almost all the parts. Probably was assembled here

Many GM and Ford parts are made outside of the US. Possibly only the design and headquarters really separates them. It’s a global supply chain for all companies.

But Ford is responsible for bad designs like EcoBoost and trucks with plastic oil pans. Peek under a Bronco, many of the steel parts aren’t even painted and body seams are not sealed. Peak 1970s manufacturing.

Plastic oil pans save weight, who even uses metal anymore?

The only time I ever got a hole in an oil pan was a metal one and it was my ex who somehow hit a rock and hid it from me. The one car I had with a plastic pan never had any issues, but it also had a skid plate that makes a larger difference than the material of the oil pan itself, since loose debris would just bounce off. Plus the skid plate helps reduce wind resistance so it’s a necessity in this day and age anyway.

There are always trade-offs. All polymers deteriorate when exposed to that kind of thermal cycling and chemical exposure. A metal alloy fit for the job can last forever.

Where car is made is irrelevant. How it is designed and engineered matters. Toyotas made in North America outlast anything designed in Detroit.

My point is that there’s really not much difference now. I’m betting many car manufacturers are starting to have AI design some parts. So where something is designed matters a lot less.

Your point doesn’t make any sense whatsoever. Different companies have different approaches to engineering and quality control, and it absolutely makes a massive difference for how long their products last. This is very obvious in the car market.

ML will likely play a massive role for engineering going forward, but again, it’s up to each company or organization to decide how to use it. I wouldn’t be surprised at all if some companies try to have LLMs weigh in on engineering matters, where they shouldn’t. AI will amplify bad engineering.

But responsible companies will make proper use of ML and their cars will be better for it.

Worked at an oil refinery in the US. All the company cars were Ford. They all had various issues such as lights not working, the reverse beeper not working, constant engine light. We would get a loaner ford to replace our fleet ford and the loaner would fucking die. It would be comical if it wasn’t my safety being jeopardized.

Depends on what you mean by American. Most assume you are referring to Ford or GM. But Tesla and Rivian are US made. Many are built in the States by non US companies. BMW, Volvo, Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Hyundai, Kia.

Tesla and Rivian are US made

Chinese batteries and many parts from Canada and Mexico.

Just like every other vehicle made anywhere in the world. It’s a global supply chain.

Tesla is a toxic brand due to Elon.

I love the idea of Rivian but they don’t want to sell in Australia and the R1/R2 have too steep/bulldozer blade of a front to sell in EU (no pedestrian rollup protection)

The dumb ones do

effectively been shut out of China.

Because Chinese won’t buy massive thirsty trucks. Wtf…Tesla was in China before they even started making EVs.

Where does en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Tesla,_Inc. say Tesla was in China first?

There’s a lot of protectionism going on in China, most western manufacturers aren’t allowed to sell their own cars without a Chinese company owning the majority of the partnership. Most countries don’t really enforce that.

The Chinese actually LOVE big cars. Every other European manufacturer makes long wheelbase versions of their midrange sedans for China exclusively. Space in the back is a status symbol more than comfort up front apparently. And there are a ton of big Chinese crossovers out now. I won’t call them SUVs because they’re not really off road capable, much like most western “SUVs” aren’t these days.

Both statements can be true at the same time. But the scale of one is many times larger.

China’s MO from rare earths and magnets to cars to silicon follows the same plan. Take IP, Subsidize the industry, Research, once you have a monopoly use it to squeeze adversaries.

I will say at least China is willing to kill off underperforming companies.

The US needs to let a lot of legacy companies that aren’t performing die off. It also needs to break up oligopolies in many industries. Why compete when you can buy up the future competitors and set prices with a handful of competitors. The financialization of our economy is choking us.

And yet even at 2-3x the price, the Chinese EVs provide a better value than the handful of the American options they would compete against.

This SUV would be competing with the likes of a high end EV option like Lucid or Tesla. The Lucid Gravity starts a around $70k, and the Tesla Model X (now discontinued) was around $92k.

The Xiaomi SU7 (the car the Ford CEO has driven since 2024, despite being banned in the US) starts at $32k and clearly is targeted to compete the Porsche Taycan at $112k.

The vehicle in this article has heated floors, a projector, a pop-up roof, a fridge, swiveling seats, and over 1,000 miles of range. Functions western companies consider “luxury” are basically just standard in the Chinese market like heated and ventilated seats. They don’t even bother to advertise things like that because it’s a minimum expectation. There are zero western options that come close to something like that. The options available in the US suck, even taking industry subsidies into account.

heated floors, a projector, a pop-up roof, a fridge, swiveling seats,

Never have I once thought I needed any of that bullshit.

And yet there it is, along with basically every other “luxury” feature western companies save for high end models… all for the price of a base model SUV here.

Those aren’t luxury car features (minus the fridge), those are camper van features lol

The point is that what western car companies consider “luxury” features they charge extra for, like heated seats and that sort of thing, are basically standard there. So the luxury features they include to separate these models from the pack are these more niche things.

it seems to want it to be like a compact RV rather than a SUV

High-end EV options

Ok

like Tesla

…fucking WHAT?

I see you forget about the first 3 models that Tesla made that were $70k or higher when they were discontinued, and all launched at $90k+

They were only high-end EVs because the EV market was dogshit then. They’ve never competed with high-end cars in general.

Unfortunately it’s a race to the bottom and high-end cars are doing the same Tesla bullshit of a minimalist interior with a huge display instead of physical buttons with heft like they used to.

Frankly, american cars could use a knockdown. Tesla was our only real hope, and we would have glided into a strong Tesla and EV empire if conservative dems didn’t bail out GM, Chrysler, and Ford. Additionally, Tesla wouldn’t have been in a position to get bought by a dumb nazi.

I’d say, let their stuff in. Lets get some good cheap and subsidizes vehicles from China on the condition that they don’t raise car prices by more than 2% a year.

American companies will more than likely fall on their face and hopefully die. Making room for a new american car company to take their place.

Chinese cars are heavily subsidized by the state

Detroit has received $88B in subsidies and loans since 2008. That’s why we have so many cheap EV options?

Heavily subsidized by misery, as well.

Detroit pays union wages and has to respect worker rights (at the top end of the supply chain). The “communist “ state seems to escape these limited obligations in big parts of their supply chains.

Workers in Detroit might get paid union wages, but many auto factories have relocated to the South where they can underpay and abuse workers much more easily. I just did some quick googling and it seems like being a factory worker in China isn’t bad compared to in the US. They work in highly automated, clean, air-conditioned spaces like would be found here. Dirty conditions and manual labor are no longer compatible with today’s automotive quality requirements. Low level workers make modest wages, but they employ a bunch of engineers and technicians just like here in the US, and they have subsidized cafeterias and some provide housing or stipends for housing. You might criticize the expectation of working significant overtime, but I’ve worked in factories which had mandatory overtime in the US, so that sort of structural coercion isn’t unique to China. Compared to a “right to work” state, Chinese workers have stronger protections from being laid off or fired. The main downside seems to be lax enforcement of safety standards. If the government doesn’t notice something unsafe on its own, there isn’t a Chinese version of dropping a hint to OSHA.

Now further upstream in the supply chain? No thanks. That’s where you’ll find abysmal working conditions. Just remember there are good reasons our government wants us to believe everything sucks for workers in China.

Oh yes, and even plum union jobs for floor workers in Windsor or Brampton can be kind of shit too, especially in some of the parts factories.

I expect that from hypercapitalist oligarch-run societies. I don’t expect it from vanguard countries. It’s a betrayal.

Good news, the Vanguard are just capitalists by another name.

Chinese cars are heavily subsidized by the state. The reason they’re so cheap is because China bets it can squeeze the competition

Used to be, to get them going, robotics, innovation and vertical integration is most of the reason now. An example, BYD have their own roro ships and have ordered another 10,

…com.au/…/byd-orders-10-more-car-carriers-export-…

and the new ships will be built in China

they make their own batteries, electric motors etc and have massive robotic assembly plants.

To suggest the reason why is because it’s not a level playing field is ludicrous, the US spends many billions subsidizing car manufacturers on top of the billions us consumers spend in subsidizing them. directly.

American car companies (and American built cars) get subsidies from the US, Canada, and Mexico as all three form a single manufacturing chain. They simply have had a different set of priorities that allowed newcomers to eat their lunch, like it happens to any complacent industry.

So you think the entire world’s auto manufacturers outside of China are incompetent and inefficient? People always act like the only vehicles sold in the US are domestic brands when they don’t even make up a majority here.

Well I wouldn’t say they’re all incompetent but look at how glacial all the “traditional” car companies have become. These guys are innovating at a speed never seen before while your traditional car manufacturers are stumbling over themselves trying to keep up.

On the german side, just take a look at BMW and how long it took for them to come up with a competent electric platform. They just got their first car on a good platform (the new X3). Mercedes still doesn’t have a good EV, and neither does Audi. Their etron is outdated.

Moving to the Japanese brands. I know Toyota isn’t focused on EVs at all and their hybrid is top notch so they’re one of the better ones out there. But no one else is even close. Not in terms of value for money. Not in terms of tech.

The only ones that get close are Tesla because, like the Chinese, they’re running their car companies like tech companies and not car companies.

What innovations are lacking specifically? I dont know of any features unique to Chinese brands. It seems more like you think every company should only be selling EVs for dirt cheap prices, but that isn’t realistic becausw those aren’t real prices and EVs aren’t yet practical for everyone which is why they make up such a small percentage of sales here still (though this number climbs with each quarter).

Corrupted by the oil industry and colluding together would be a better term. Someone please stop China, they are destroying the “EVs are luxury vehicles only” gimmick.

Well, in Germany VW (the second largest automobile manufacturer in the world) now is laying off a significant portion of their employees, closing factories and even selling them off to US/Israeli weapons manufacturers. Their head also already signaled VW is being open to switch to weapons manufacturing. Pretty sure other German brands are in similar peril.

Traditional manufacturers are dead.

They chose to actively ignore EV technology. Despite 80-100 years of manufacturing , they got overtaken by China in just 15 years.

You mean Volks “we don’t even make an effort for our cars to obbey emission rules and instead we cheated” wagen is having trouble staying afloat?!

I wonder how such a high quality company which was not at all doing funny business and using political connections is having trouble competing with those who just offer better products at lower prices …

Volkswagen has made a ton of dumb mistakes, but among the worst are paying union wages and not getting super cheap lithium batteries from being located in a country that has a well integrated supply chain.

We don’t want to mine or refine lithium as much in the EU because “boohoo muh environment” but really, if we want to compete with China we can’t let the environment be a deciding factor. Mine and refine all the resources we need instead of buying them from China and letting them dictate the prices. China doesn’t give a fuck about small issues standing in its way and neither should we.

“We can’t let the environment be a deciding factor” is a preposterous take. There’s practically nothing more important that preserving the environment. Even the Chinese are looking beyond their borders for raw materials these days. If it costs more to extract raw materials in a way that doesn’t fuck up the environment, then subsidize it and pay for it. We can fund the subsidies with a carbon tax.

It’s not a preposterous take for China. They do whatever it takes to win and it shows. Lower wages, less considerations for the environment, etc.

Everything we care about has a cost. If we want the cheapest possible EVs, which most people here seem to want, then we need to ignore everything else. So you decide. Do you want super cheap EVs, or do you want good working conditions and limited pollution? And if it’s the latter, tariffs on Chinese EVs make sense because they do not adhere by the same rules.

I want the latter, and tariffs are not the only way go about protectionism. There is also subsidization, which is how the US has maintained its defense and agriculture industries. If we want stuff made domestically, we’re going to have to pay for it. Subsidies are generally preferable to tariffs because they can be paid through progressive taxation instead of regressive taxes on consumers.

The thing is, if the American government wants to be protectionist against Chinese cars, IMHO they need to pass legally binding legislation to force US car manufacturers to meet or exceed what the Chinese cars are offering and then directly subsidize the cost of those vehicles to the consumer, freely, with no stipulations. The punishment for failure to meet and exceed those expectations should be bankruptcy through immediate removal of the protectionist mechanisms.

The US is too busy licking other corps boots. They do not have enough funds to do it for everyone.

They’d probably need to tax the rich a significant amount of money to do that.

They tried when Japanese cars became popular for being efficient, the US car companies preferred to pretty much abandon the rest of the world and keep the government money.

They’ve been banned lol, like for decades

Yes, I fear those SUVs but not because that one is cheap, for an SUV but because oversized SUVs kill people (at a much higher rate than regular cars, even those with comparable loading volume).

My eyes definitely fear it

Xiaomi Has a Luxury SUV for $31,000 That All Western Brands Pederstrians Should Fear

I always love seeing the headlines that say “west should fear when other countries beat them at their own game”. It’s the same stupid rhetoric that Trump keeps barking about AI and how “we have to beat China”.

Mate, you all fucking caused everything to happen. Where do you see anything that says “Made in USA” anymore? Not that that would mean much today anyway given the shit quality the US has, but seriously.

They’re just making up hysteria based on nothing. Nobody wants to fucking go to an office 5 days a week just to do remote meetings. Nobody wants to be dependent on cars for getting around.

Nobody wants all this forced AI shit in our everyday lives. Just get over it. The endless conquest of world domination held by a handful of influencers is over. The world must change and to start, it must end all of this greedy ass capitalism which only seeks to cause misfortune for the rest of us.

Ross Perot warned everyone. They laughed at his ears.

Yes there were warnings before but his was probably the last chance we had.

In my experience Chinese cars have loads of cool features that sometimes even work.

Sometimes they don’t even try to kill you while driving (often they do)

Kind of like teslas!

Yes.

Poptop camper 😍

archive.ph/juGlN

You’re welcome.

archive.today link :(

Sorry, what’s the problem?

If you can’t reach that resource, it’s your DNS provider being a limp-wristed dick. Change providers.

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2026/02/wikipedia-bans-archive-today-after-site-executed-ddos-and-altered-web-captures/

Archive today was (is? I stopped following the story shortly after it broke) DDoSing some person’s blog. Archive today was also found to be changing some of the content of archived pages.

If this is the biggest shenanigans that the site has gotten into over its entire existence, imma not gonna throw the baby out with the bath water just yet.

Any site owner has a right to remain anonymous. I would also take serious issue if someone started unmasking a high-profile project that I have taken extreme pains to keep separate from my private/meatworld existence. I would likely not behave as badly, but I would certainly pull out as many stops to make their life as uncomfortable/inconvenient as possible.

And why is it so relatively cheap? Where did they cut corners? Are they spying on you like the cheap Chinese TVs? It can’t be just because it’s government subsidized.

They are spying yes,all the others are too which doesnt make it ok but that is why it is subsidised by the state.

They cut corners on comfort and noise levels from my experience of similar brands

Rather would get spied on by domestic corps than foreign ones.

Why? The domestic corps actually have access to you to use that information. What’s china gonna do with my data that is gonna affect me 12k miles away?

Coorporate with other entitities and then sell a full picture on me to the local authorities?
Idk mate. Honestly.
How about no spying? Can we do that?

Sure, but i guess it literally doesn’t affect me if china or intergalactic aliens are spying on me. What affects me is the local govt spying on me.

Interesting viewpoint I have not yet considered.
Thanks for sharing your perspective.

Boot licking mentality

Oh so you’d like to rather lick the foreign boot?
Very nice.
American, Russian, Chinese or Israeli?

America is israel. I am not the one who showed a preference for which boot to lick.

Very nice avoidance of my question. Then say, which one you’d lick if your life depended on it.
The domestic or the foreign one?

Why does my life depend on it?

Question avoidance.

You want to be spied on. You are an idiot.

If
Not want to

Jesus christ. And I am not even religious.

The motive isn’t to extract as much capital out of the customers as possible.

The Chinese government is subsidizing them to gain market share just like American tech companies do with VC funding.

One way the Chinese government is “subsidizing” their cars is by suppressing the living standards of its people.

That and their industry doesn’t appear to be as bloated and shareholder-driven.

Chinese people don’t invest in stocks because you’d have to be a fool to compete with the Chinese government as an investor. Returns are perpetually suppressed.

JFC Lemmy… BYD is a public company and was originally funded by Warren Buffet. He made almost 9 billion.

Key figures and findings regarding BYD’s government funding include:

 The Kiel Institute Study (2018–2022): A widely cited study by Germany’s Kiel Institute for the World Economy estimated that BYD received approximately $3.7 billion (€3.4 billion) in direct government subsidies between 2018 and 2022.  

 Scaling Support: State aid to the company ramped up significantly over time. For example, out of the $3.7 billion tracked through 2022, a major share—roughly $2.2 billion—was awarded in 2022 alone.  

 Annual Financial Disclosures: BYD regularly lists government grants, subsidies, and R&D support in its public financial reports. For instance, annual filings have shown billions of yuan in recurring state backing channeled into specific production lines and technological innovations.

Broader Context

While the $3.7 billion figure covers tracked direct corporate aid, international trade analysts and economists point out that BYD’s total structural advantages also stem from wider government policies. These include:  

 Supply Chain Subsidies: Extensive state backing upstream in the EV supply chain, particularly for battery manufacturers (such as localized support for lithium processing and battery cell production).

 Infrastructure and Operational Perks: Access to heavily subsidized land, cheap electricity, and localized tax incentives designed to accelerate China’s green technology and clean energy sectors.

Basically, the only thing the US failed to do from this list was a successful pivot to green technologies and the cheap, abundant electricity they could provide. There were many plans that had plans to process and build lithium batteries, that were dismantled after Trump 2.

Honestly I do think the US should do this too. But as China is currently the only one doing it on this scale, it is vastly skewing market dynamics.

suppressing the living standards of its people.

You mean letting billionaires avoid tax, adding tariffs to everything, and driving up the price of gas?

I would prefer no spying. But with the US being a fascist surveillance state run by greedy billionaires, American cars are no better. Either pick one from a functioning liberal country or focus on the tech. China is clearly ahead on tech.

Can we just fucking STOP doing SUVs please? And huge trucks. And all the rest of that oversized garbage.

No

But without SUVs, people would be embarrassed driving minivans and without huge trucks, there would be nothing to compensate for small penises.

Gen X shoulda boughta fucking wagon like their parents.

[ ](external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F…)

I’m Genx. No kids still at home. I got a minivan (6 cyl Grand Caravan) and will keep having a minivan because they’re versatile as fuck. I’m on my 3rd right now. They’re comfortable to drive long distances, handle well in the snow, and have buttons for controls instead of a touch screen.

Haul 8 people. No problem. Haul 4x8 sheets of plywood. No problem. Camp in the back. No problem. Move a couch. No problem. Haul a small camper or trailer. No problem.

I fold the seats and slide in a sheet of 1/2 inch 4x8 plywood in the back to make loading/unloading easy.

They’re cheap too. You can pick one up just a few years old for a few thousand.

Bring on an era where minivans are cool again, SUVs are tacky, and hot hatches + coupes reign supreme.

I want a mostly analog microbus body on a kei size frame. Standardized universal plug ins with easily swappable parts. Basically easily accessible media/electronic wiring internally where we can swap the wiring harness, speakers and receiver. A standard sized motor slot for each wheel and same for battery slot and hookups. If new battery technology comes out, they make it to fit the same size slot with adapters pre-fit so no modifications are needed.

If a motor goes bad set to a temporary mode where all power goes to front or back wheel depending on which died… drive into shop lift car, put on standardized lift… Mechanic knows where full shut off switch is that disconnects battery from all components, lift already grounds frame by setup and pulling the bolts removing the motor and swapping it with a standardized replacement should be able to be done in minutes. The mechanic shouldn’t need to know much at that point, but still good to have someone who does multiple a day than someone who does 1 every 7-10 years.

Universal light sockets blah blah blah.

So if you want “smart” features, they are in your chosen swappable part, Bluetooth, wifi, CD, 8-track, whatever, your choice, your slots. Obviously, 8 track might not fit but if everything is standardized, accessory hookups become easy to make

That would be ideal; something of an Open Platform with fully interchangeable parts.

It’s not quite fully everything we’d want, but that Slate truck that was announced (launched?) last year seems like it’s a step in the right direction.

The issue at play largely is that customer demand needs to make such options not only viable for manufacturers - but an outright requirement in order for them to remain competitive and relevant.

To me I thought telos started right, then fucked themselves.

nothing to compensate for small penises.

That’s not true!!! Just about everything that a mid-life crisis covers, can be a compensation for a small penis.

I think people who have never driven one or feel uncomfortable getting one and gets one because they feel they’re getting more for their money shouldn’t be driving them at all.

I think people who want one should rent one that way they have practice and they have to be careful with the vehicle because it’s on loan but the one thing I noticed when just about everyone switched to mini-suv’s and full sized ones and trucks, that there’s more people who have never driven one in their life and it’s noticeable.

I just don’t want to be hit by someone who has no idea how to manage driving one because of their size and depth perception being thrown off other than that who gives a fuck what people drive. If someone wants to drop money on something stupidly oversized and uses a fuckload of gas, let em.

American need a husky fit vehicle.

Most of these these new SUVs aren’t huge SUVs of the 90s - like Ford Explorer. They’re basically the new station wagon but barely larger than a sedan like a Camry.

A crossover is a station wagon but the entire thing is raised up for no reason. It’s funny how averse the public is to driving a minivan. I drove one as a rental for a week and it was snappy, convenient, comfortable, and could hold a ton of stuff or people.

Minivans’ case isn’t really helped here in Europe by the fact that they’re cheap econoboxes with 2 liter or smaller engines. The Chrysler minivan with its V6 is just about the only exception. And the Mercedes one, but that hasn’t been available in well over a decade. We don’t get the Sienna or the Odyssey for example.

Xiaomi first car is an amazing sport sedan: SU7. Followed by my personal favorite, the YU7. Actually the SU7 has been the best selling car in China for a few months.

The Skynomad, this new SUV, strangely is not marketed as Xiaomi but purely as Skynomad. They have separate stores, whereas the SU7 and YU7 are in the normal Xiaomi stores, between the phones fridges and laptops. Definitely a different target audience so that could be the strategy. It doesn’t have a Xiaomi badge either.

The same goes for Huawei, who have a whole suit of different models and types of cars. The most insane one, from innovation perspective, is the Maestro, a competitor for Rolls-Royce.

All serious car manufacturers do this. Do you think Lexus, Infiniti, et al are their own brands?

I’m a car nut so yes I’m very aware and knowledgeable. However Lexus is Toyota which is a well established brand for many decades before they branched out. The same with Infinity.

Xiaomi is just starting out making cars for 3 years now, only have 2 models, and should work on their own brand first, before creating a new brand. The market in China in EV’s is already extremely competitive. So introducing another brand, just is complicated for the consumer. Xiaomi is such an established brand here, keep it under that banner.

And the Skynomad is nothing special or high end luxury. That was my point. Build your brand first and in due time, create the spinoff if needed. Now in China, everything is accelerated but still.

I suspect they wanted a new brand for their non-EVs so it wouldn’t dilute the Xiaomi brand? This one is a plug-in hybrid in reality, though the technical term is EREV as you can’t drive on the petrol engine, it only charges the battery

But I like being able to see over everyone else

• everyone

At this point I’m planning to see under everyone else.

Claps to some of the people here thinking Mainland China is “perfection”.

Now if doogee starts making armored jeeps, gg.

Yeah great, I’ll pass on the CCP/PLA owned automobile companies.

Thankfully in the US we won’t get the choice because they’re not allowed to sell here to protect our domestic producers from competition so we can just give them more money the next time they need to be bailed out.

They pretty much do the same in China. Tesla I believe is or was the only foreign manufacturer allowed to own their Chinese business. Everyone else had to set up a Chinese subsidiary majority owned by a Chinese automaker.

Nothing stopping Xiaomi from doing the same with Ford or GM in the US as far as I know?

US auto makers have done such things before. For a few years, GM sold the Chevy Luv which was a rebadged Izuzu. Ford has done the same with Volkswagon and others.

I prefer domestic exploitation to the Chinese.

If the billionaires raping my life and my country are American, they are welcome. If they are Chinese, then fuck the CCP.

(do I need /s here?)

Not in the US. We have a captive market that keeps us from ever seeing one.

An SUV for that price… In sure Chinese sweatshop factory workers are paid fairly and work in safe conditions and get regular breaks, vacations, aock leave, etc… Right?

Because if not, you’d be buying products from slavery yet somehow I don’t see that argument very much

Not denying sweatshops over there, but it’s highly likely these are mostly built by robots in empty buildings.

Yeah. Watched a factory tour and assembly for sany equipment. Excavators and such. There’s people involved. But the facilities are clean automated and far from sweat shop looking. They make damn good equipment. I used to think it’s junk. Then I had to fix a couple. Impressive stuff from those guys.

So, instead of Chinese robot slavery, buy from American or Mexican human slavery?

but American slaves were convicted!

Mostly of being not white, but you know . . .

America has UAW, which is about a quarter of the reason American cars are so expensive. They’re paying their factory workers way too much.

Show me a car without the Chinese components or the Chinese labor involved in its manufacture?

Auto factories are well known for providing above average working conditions and career paths for their workers in China (high skill, robots). This is one product you would want to buy to support worker rights in China which notoriously have almost no rights or representstion.

I’m not sure. There was a guy on Lemmy saying essentially that the “wages are actually pretty good in auto manufacturing, but of course you have to do 60+ hours a week for them to be good, not be lazy and do 40” from his own experience in China.

60+ hours is kinda the norm in China though

They are doing something though, it’s called long term planning.

It annoys me so much that the western world has stopped doing it and is just thinking short term.

True, that’s also why we stopped valuing education the same way we used to. The wild part is that we can’t even think 20 years out. Hopefully most of us will still be alive 20 years from now. We should plan like that is the case.

They’re actually doing everything.

Isn’t every part of their auto industry heavily subsidized?

Yes, just like the auto industry in the United States. The only difference is that the state also directs their companies to do good things rather than just bailing them out.

I wasn’t asking about the United States, I don’t live in that shithole country. I was asking about China. The meme suggests that China does nothing for their auto industry. That is false.

It was a point of comparison. I’m coming back to Lemmy from a long bout of using Instagram and the meme I posted is just a common reaction image to news about China. I didn’t mean to offend, sorry.

You should worry a ton about the kind of spying which could be embedded in their cars, or terrible security like the UK found in Huawei phone masts.

How much worse could it be than most cars already being sold? Will they also be selling my driving habits to insurance companies?

Lol ok the U.S. is mandating cars have remote shutdown and cameras the watch you while you drive, and the ALPRs already track you everywhere. I’d rather the CCP have my data than any private U.S. company.

Same in Europe disguised as “safety think of the children features” that interpret Asian drivers as asleep lmao

Looks kind of ugly and spies on you.

Everything spies on you now LOL.

If you’re reading this on your phone, guess what? Your phone is spying on you. Turn off your phone and watch some TV. Your TV is spying on you.

Dumb TV no spy

Yeah, but not everything is wankpanzer that has a much higher kill rate than reasonably designed cars.

And your Western-made car doesn’t? Ha!

Ew western car. I drive a japenese car

Japan is honorary Western.

(So is Korea.)

Thanks for the ad. I really needed it.

An suv we cant buy

If only you guys had democracy

Here it is:

youtu.be/DLQwbsofIgw

Lots and lots of motors to fail.

Removed video.

Got a source on this claim?

Given the quality of some of their cheaper cars, this is a probably a shitbox.

You mean “their” as in general to the whole Chinese car industry including the shitboxes sold by GM under the Buick brand? Or only Xiaomi cars?

Because Xiaomi exclusively sells luxury cars, their other “cheaper” model costs $35k, maybe you are confused for another brand?

Do you work for the company? Jebus.

Looks like Rolls-Royce Cullinan from China.

It’s not just brands that should fear it, but also people living in cities. Say no to SUVs, even if you “sometimes go to camping, once or twice a year” (yeah, that’s the justification for everyone buying them).

All Western car makers are already shitting themselves because of Chinese cars. Have been for at least a few years now.

Even Ford’s CEO openly said that Chinese EVs are better, more technologically advanced, and cheaper than Western cars. He also said that after driving a Xiaomi car for 6 months he doesn’t want to go back to Western cars.

Again, this is the CEO of Ford.

Sources:

• roadandtrack.com/…/ford-ceo-jim-farley-praises-xi…
• insideevs.com/news/…/ford-ceo-china-evs-humbled/

Western brands don’t care cause they just lobby to ban them from the west.